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Thread: PCPnC 850W SSI - First Impressions - 56K Beware

  1. #1
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    PCPnC 850W SSI - First Impressions - 56K Beware

    I had been looking to upgrade one of my PS's for a number of weeks now. Had looked at 5 different supplies, queried manufacturers, and pondered the choices. First inclination was the PCPnC 510 SLI, but it was borderline at best for my long term needs. Looked at a couple 600W to 700W supplies, but they either had problems or I couldn't get the kind of detailed info I needed about them. Finally had to bite the bullet and pull the trigger. What follows is NOT a review or official test, too many other things going on to do a complete one atm. Only set aside time for first impressions, pics, a spattering of bench data, some IDCs, and JfGnG's about the supply. Have only gotten to poke, prod, and smack it around for a handful of nights now, but here's the info and a first impression of the new PC Power and Cooling 850W SSI power supply starting with it's arrival:


    Arrival - UPS delivers

    Even though the PS itself is built like a tank, PCPnC shipped the unit in a nice oversized sturdy box. Just for GnGs, here's a pic that shows just how sturdy the box is



    For reference, there's a 6'1" 180+ pound nut case bouncing on the balls of those big grey things in the pic (but not so looney that I didn't take the PS out before I tried this hehe )

    As anyone with a digicam knows, one of the first things one does is take pics... you know, for insurance purposes Here's a small collage of them:

    Top center is the PS with the cables layed out. Lower left shows the size of the PS compared to its little brother, a PCPnC Turbo-Cool 450W PS. Center bottom is the obligatory markings pic. Bottom right shows the cable mass exiting the PS.



    Notice that the supply comes standard with an 8-pin ATX12V connector for dual-CPU MBs. The 8-pin to 4-pin adapter cable shown is optional, allowing its use with single or dual CPU MBs.

    PCPnC includes the requisite 4 mounting screws and AC cord. An additional, minor feature I liked, which was missing from the 450ATX, is a power switch on the back of the unit... keeps one from having to unplug the AC cord to remove power during component changes


    Power output ratings and details

    As has become standard with PCPnC supplies, the unit is of industrial grade quality and rated at its full power output at 50C. Speaking of power ratings, here they are:

    Total continuous output power : 850W
    Total peak output power : 950W
    +5V @ 30A and +3.3V @ 30A
    Four 12V rails @ 17A each
    +5V Standby @ 2.0A, -12V @ 0.8A

    I had queried PCPnC on quite a number of things before purchasing the supply, one of which is the allocation of the 12V rails. Here's the breakdown:

    They've allotted one rail (12V@17A) for supplying the two PCIe Graphics Card cables. Considering the current spec allows only 6.25A per card, there's a nice 32% margin here

    One of the 12V rails is dedicated to supplying power for HDs, fans, and miscellaneous 12V power requirements. As a point of reference, that's only 1A less than the 450ATX put out for everything.

    It's designed for supplying power to multiple CPU MB's, as evidenced by the 8-pin 12VATX cnx and 34A rating, which is where the other two 12V rails are allocated. The 8-to-4 pin adapter cable shown in the pics previously joins the two 12V 17A rails, giving a nice 34A for single CPU abuse, enough even for OC'ing those power hungy Intel dual-cores coming down the pike.

    I would be remiss if I didn't also discuss here the "limitations" placed on the various rail combinations by PCPnC, so....

    The combined power draw on the +5V and +3.3V rails was spec'd for 200W continous with the 12V supply rails maxed out. This is really a thermal limit placed on the PS by PCPnC, and it should be noted also that this limit is for a 50C ambient environment and meant to keep the total continuous power at or below 850W.

    The other limitation placed on the unit is a 54A continuous rating for the four 12V rails combined, with a 62A peak rating. As with the other rails, this too is a thermal limit, for operation at 50C, and in this case with the 5.5V/3.3V rail combination pulling 200W.

    With the actual design of the supply and individual rail ratings, you really have more flexibility than indicated, more so if the inlet temp at the supply is below 50C. I won't list all the possibilities here, but I think it's safe to say this supply would not be the limiting factor in a system.

    Now what about noise/ripple and regulation? Well, PCPnC has it spec'd out at 1% max noise/ripple peak-to-peak and 1% load/line regulation for all the positive supply rails. That's a total variation due to the combined effects of load variations, noise, and ripple of 2%, better than most PS's give for either one individually

    Last specs - the supply has active Power Factor Correction with a 0.98 spec'd correction factor and a power conversion efficiency rating of 85%, both excellent values.


    The Guts of the Beast

    Ok, enough of the specs, let's take a look inside this puppy and how she does

    Here's a little collage of the insides of the PS and some looks at the rails (full size pics in thumbnails further down):



    You'll notice as you look through the pics that this 8 pound beast is indeed built like the proverbial tank. And from the input EMI filter all the way through to the output filters, high quality, high temp components are used throughout the unit, along with multiple high grade PWBs and heatsinks galore. The entire supply is built on a main PWB, with individual "daughterboards" mounted perpendicular to the main board and running most of the length of the supply, which also have smaller controller baby daughterboards on them. Everything appears well thought out and designed for reliability and performance, with wiring only where there's no other feasible choice. I won't describe each pic in detail, but notice the size and quality of the caps and inductors used througout and the overall workmanship.

    In two of the pics, you'll find 4 adjustment pots. These are not accessible externally on a standard supply... but nothing a drill wouldn't fix, being as they are conveniently mounted together on the edge of the main PWB

    While far from done checking this PS out, here are some bits and pieces.


    Initial look at performance

    After giving the insides a going over, chained this beast up on the bench. For the initial look see borrowed a few drives from one of my rigs ( 2 Seagate Cuda's, a Plextor DVD R/W and a CD R/W drive) and mated them with a DFI NF4, a mildly OC'd Winnie on air, a floppy (yes, still use one on my bench .), 1GB of memory, dual 6600GTs I haven't gotten around to modding yet, and a couple of high output 120mm fans. Not much of a load for this beast, so I added ~72W of static load on each of the PCIe connectors.

    Over the course of a few days and testing of various things, I periodically checked the supply. From idle to full bore the maximum variation I saw on any of the main supply rails was 30 mV measured at the PS connectors with a DMM. At any given load point the fluctuation was <= 10mV.

    An anectedotal piece of info... last night while memtest was running at an "edge frequency" looping T5, we had a storm pass thru. An incadescent desk lamp I had on the bench dimmed to less than half brightness half a dozen times during a couple minute period, for times ranging from 2 to 6 secs. The PCPnC was plugged into the same power strip, yet not a single error occurred during the entire time. As a point of reference, I've inadvertently induced failures during the sequence before when probing the MB with a high impedance scope probe.

    Speaking of noise/ripple and a scope... here are some pics of the +12V, +5V, and +3.3V rails. These are short term time elapsed pics, two of which I had to post-process to adjust the gamma on enough to make out the graticle lines (highlighted), which were turned off. They're a tad grainy, but try taking time elasped pics with one hand while holding a scope probe to a MB with the other sometime One note on the scope pics, the high frequency noise present is from the MB/CPU/Mem etc.






    Other comments

    This falls in the IDC category, but the fan at this load level was quiet. Couldn't hear it over the MB and CPU fans at all. Had to bend down and get my ear within about 6" to hear it and even then had to be in front of it's exhaust. Was a nice low pitched tone... not a loud high pitched squeal.

    The price, well a couple of comments here. First, buy direct from PCPnC and save yourself the 20% to 25% markup you'll pay to get it elsewhere. Second, this supply isn't for you if your only intent is to power your current generation, single processor MB with a handful of drives and fans... the 510-SLI will more than meet your needs. But, if you want a supply that will give you head-of-the-class performance, you tend to OC the dickens out of your hardware and throw everything but the kitchen sink at your supply, and want a reliable supply that can handle anything you throw at it now or in the future, then you might consider the 850 SSI. I expect this one will meet any needs I may have for at least the next 5 years and there isn't much hardware-wise I could say that for.

    Peace








    Disclaimer: Any errors, ommisions, or other errata are mine, all mine... and you can't have them No Winnies or RAMs were harmed during the making of this post.

  2. #2
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    This space reserved

    Ok, here's use one of this reserved space

    How to use the 850SSI (or a Zippy) and the 5V rail for Vmem
    Last edited by EMC2; 06-11-2005 at 10:53 AM.

  3. #3
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    madness!

    The Quad 12v rails seems like the Silverstone 650w - 2 rails for cpu, 1 rail for GFX and 1 for everything else.

    This power supply will own all else though with it's amazing low ripple rails and quality !

  4. #4
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    pretty nice looking.. lots of info for such a "quick" look at it.. lol

    All along the watchtower the watchmen watch the eternal return.

  5. #5
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    wow very nice and expected to be for US$450-560+ bucks heh
    ---

  6. #6
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    I didn't understand what did you asked from PC P&C to do for your 12V rail. Can you explain it to me a little better? Thanks.

    Nice review btw!

  7. #7
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    How about a review on PCP&Cs tech support? Looks like a nice psu, but I wouldn't dare touch a PCP&C psu ever again after trying in vain to get their tech support team to respond to my requests for assistance.

    Good luck if anything goes wrong with it.
    £58.73 - This is the amount of money a loyal customer is worth to Overclockers.co.uk

    Beware of buying from overclockers.co.uk, they will swindle you by abusing the consumer law if they need to refund you for faulty hardware. Thieving gits

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hombre
    I didn't understand what did you asked from PC P&C to do for your 12V rail. Can you explain it to me a little better? Thanks.

    Nice review btw!
    Maybe I missed it, but I didnt see him mention asking them to do anything?

    All along the watchtower the watchmen watch the eternal return.

  9. #9
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    What kind of customization options do they have?

  10. #10
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    Woah, that's a beast!
    Nice post, some good info in there, thanks!

    G

  11. #11
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    --- Stevil ---

    If you ever saw my "non-quick" looks, you would understand


    --- Eva ---

    Their original target price was quoted in the low 400s range US$. As a result of demand (mainly OEMs) it started off mid 400s, but I would expect after the initial "rush" is over, it'll go back down.


    --- Hombre ---

    Thanks The comment about the 12V rails wasn't a mod request by me... it was a query of them on how the rails were allocated in the stock units


    --- GazC ---

    Having previously read about your probs with their support, I can understand your point and sorry to hear of them. Maybe you can start a poll about it

    Regarding my "luck"... as you might notice in one of the pics, this isn't the first PCPnC PS I've owned. I've never had an issue with their support or in getting a response from them... like I have with others. Regardless of how many Qs I've asked or what I've requested over the years, they have always been helpful and in the case of emails, responded within 2 days. Maybe it's because of how I ask/request... or maybe it's because I'm in the US. Don't know the why, but my experiences have always been positive in that regard as well. Isn't because I'm a "regular" customer either... my PS purchases tend to be spaced out quite a bit. Isn't because I'm a "homer" either... in fact as I said up front, I was looking elsewhere this time because they didn't have what I needed at the time and had I had luck elsewhere, would have gone another way. Then again, I've got a DFI SLI-DR that has been "stretched" for over a month now without any problems in the least and.... nm, I won't bore you... so maybe I do simply have "good luck"


    --- shadowing ---

    Previous experience, both mine and others I've talked with, has been basically this regarding customization - "What do you want, here is what it would cost and how long it will take." The only limitations I've experienced before is, "Can't do that because of Agency XYZ regulations" and "that would require a complete redesign." There have been some on XtremeSystems that have had "remote" trim pots added to their supplies (on the end of long cables for mounting on front panel of chassis) for example.

    In the case of this PS in particular, they have a very high OEM demand at the moment and they are in "catch-up-mode" making them, so time frames may be a bit longer than usual. Any of their other units, they typically turn customizations in less than a week.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by eva2000
    wow very nice and expected to be for US$450-560+ bucks heh
    Can't a redundant PSU be purchased for that much?

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    lol same price as a gas electric generator :P

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muppetmower
    lol same price as a gas electric generator :P
    or any number of gfx cards, or mid-range CPUs, or heck what about a mid-range washing machine, or.... the point and its relevance?

  15. #15
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    MMMMMM, that is one beefy PSU.


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  16. #16
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    looks good..


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  17. #17
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    threads like this with actual content are what makes a forum great

    thanks EMC2!!

    can you see the light? is it shining too bright? can you see the light at the end of the tunnel, i know i do, i know its true.

  18. #18
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    that's a bit overkilled for everage overclockers, though I agreed with you that you get what you paid for, and it will handle whatever you throw at it, I'm sure you won't have to worry about upgrading the PSU in the next 5 years with that much juice to spare, cpu die is getting smaller and smaller and they require less and less power to operate, I bet you can even run a peltier off of that beast to cool your GPU I love my 510 SLI too, and nice review btw.
    Core i7 920 D0 3844A717 4.40Ghz HT on @1.36v (LinX/Prime/3D stable), Corsair 850W, 12GB OCZ Platinum 1600, P6T Deluxe V2, EVGA GTX 285 SS, OCZ Vortex SSD 30GB x3 RAID0, HAF 932.
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  19. #19
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    The interanal pots are for tuning the output of the various rails? If so, wouldn't the active PFC kick in when a rail is too high?
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  20. #20
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    wow, that is impressive
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  21. #21
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    Oh, I see, thank you for your answer EMC2. STEvil, it was my mistake of understanding the text.

    I've got a bunch of question regarding this PSU:

    - You said that this PSU has four rails (3.3V, 5V, 12V). What's the 4th rail for?
    - Do this PSU got one pot for the four splitted 12V rails? How do you customize each 12V rail? If you set one 12v rail to 12.5v, will all others turn the same?
    - What is the size of the fan on the back of the PSU?
    - AFAIK PC P&C do their testing and rates thier PSU @ 40C, which only indicates how extreme these PSU's are... This is a known fact I think.

    I made a conclusion that it's really the best PSU out there right now (and five years ahead ). It took the performance crown from the Zippy... I think i'll shell out my next paychecks for this 850 beast.

    Thanks in advance,
    Best regards,
    Hombre
    Last edited by Hombre; 04-11-2005 at 01:47 AM.

  22. #22
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    Very Nice, want to buy me one?

  23. #23
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    OMG what a killer psu it must be heavy.

  24. #24
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    I like it! "ponders theof working sunday (double time) to pay for one"

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferry82
    OMG what a killer psu it must be heavy.
    Yeah... And huge too, you need at least a LL PC75 / CM Stacker or any other roomy full tower to fir this beast into your case.
    Last edited by Hombre; 04-11-2005 at 09:45 AM.

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